[Skim-app-users] Synchronizing skim notes via Dropbox

[Alan Harper (lists)]

Dropbox does not synchronize the extended attributes that Skim uses to
store notes. I think that with a small modification to Skim, it would be
easy to use .skim files to maintain synchronized notes across computers.

When I add a pdf to Computer A and then make some notes (and have
"Automatically save Skim notes backups" checked), then the notes are saved
to the extended attributes and a .skim file is created.

If I then open the pdf on Computer B, Skim notices that there is a .skim
file (brought over by Dropbox) but no .skim notes (since the extended
attribute was not synchronized), and helpfully asks me whether I want to
read the notes from the .skim file. This behavior is exactly right in my
opinion.

If I then change the the notes on computer B, the change is reflected in
the .skim file on computer A, but not in the .pdf file, and I have to
remember to read the notes on A in order to have them synchronized.

However, it should be easy to have Skim offer to read the notes, just as it
does in the first case.

When I save the notes on computer B, the modify date of both the .pdf and
the .skim files are updated. But when I go back to computer A, the modify
date of the .pdf is older than the .skim file on that computer. (Dropbox
brought the .skim file over, but since there was no change, for the
attributes that Dropbox monitors, in the .pdf, the modify date of the .pdf
was not changed).

If Skim noticed that the .skim file had a later modify date than the .pdf,
and offered to read the notes from the .skim file, it would make keeping
the notes in sync easy. Skim could put up the message like ("The notes
associated with this file may have been modified, would you like to load
the new notes?") I don't see any downside to this behavior, but perhaps I
haven't thought enough about it.

I don't think that this would violate Christiaan's rule against sidecar
files, which I can understand, even if I don't always agree with it.

Alan

[Patrik Jonsson]

Hi Alan,

A couple of years ago, I patched my version of Skim to do just this. If I
remember correctly, I just switched the order such that .skim files take
precedence over the extended attributes when opening a file. I've used this
to sync my PDFs via Dropbox since and I'm very happy with how it's been
working.

Because I've been happy with it, I haven't tried to port my patch to
current versions of Skim, so I don't know if it even applies these days. If
you're interested, I'd be happy to send you my patch for you to try, though.

Regards,

/Patrik

Post by Alan Harper (lists)
Dropbox does not synchronize the extended attributes that Skim uses to
store notes. I think that with a small modification to Skim, it would be
easy to use .skim files to maintain synchronized notes across computers.
When I add a pdf to Computer A and then make some notes (and have
"Automatically save Skim notes backups" checked), then the notes are saved
to the extended attributes and a .skim file is created.
If I then open the pdf on Computer B, Skim notices that there is a .skim
file (brought over by Dropbox) but no .skim notes (since the extended
attribute was not synchronized), and helpfully asks me whether I want to
read the notes from the .skim file. This behavior is exactly right in my
opinion.
If I then change the the notes on computer B, the change is reflected in
the .skim file on computer A, but not in the .pdf file, and I have to
remember to read the notes on A in order to have them synchronized.
However, it should be easy to have Skim offer to read the notes, just as
it does in the first case.
When I save the notes on computer B, the modify date of both the .pdf and
the .skim files are updated. But when I go back to computer A, the modify
date of the .pdf is older than the .skim file on that computer. (Dropbox
brought the .skim file over, but since there was no change, for the
attributes that Dropbox monitors, in the .pdf, the modify date of the .pdf
was not changed).
If Skim noticed that the .skim file had a later modify date than the .pdf,
and offered to read the notes from the .skim file, it would make keeping
the notes in sync easy. Skim could put up the message like ("The notes
associated with this file may have been modified, would you like to load
the new notes?") I don't see any downside to this behavior, but perhaps I
haven't thought enough about it.
I don't think that this would violate Christiaan's rule against sidecar
files, which I can understand, even if I don't always agree with it.
Alan
--
Alan Harper
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[Christiaan Hofman]

Dropbox does not synchronize the extended attributes that Skim uses to store notes. I think that with a small modification to Skim, it would be easy to use .skim files to maintain synchronized notes across computers.
When I add a pdf to Computer A and then make some notes (and have "Automatically save Skim notes backups" checked), then the notes are saved to the extended attributes and a .skim file is created.
If I then open the pdf on Computer B, Skim notices that there is a .skim file (brought over by Dropbox) but no .skim notes (since the extended attribute was not synchronized), and helpfully asks me whether I want to read the notes from the .skim file. This behavior is exactly right in my opinion.
If I then change the the notes on computer B, the change is reflected in the .skim file on computer A, but not in the .pdf file, and I have to remember to read the notes on A in order to have them synchronized.
However, it should be easy to have Skim offer to read the notes, just as it does in the first case.
When I save the notes on computer B, the modify date of both the .pdf and the .skim files are updated. But when I go back to computer A, the modify date of the .pdf is older than the .skim file on that computer. (Dropbox brought the .skim file over, but since there was no change, for the attributes that Dropbox monitors, in the .pdf, the modify date of the .pdf was not changed).
If Skim noticed that the .skim file had a later modify date than the .pdf, and offered to read the notes from the .skim file, it would make keeping the notes in sync easy. Skim could put up the message like ("The notes associated with this file may have been modified, would you like to load the new notes?") I don't see any downside to this behavior, but perhaps I haven't thought enough about it.
I don't think that this would violate Christiaan's rule against sidecar files, which I can understand, even if I don't always agree with it.
Alan
--
Alan Harper

Yes, this goes strongly against my problems with sidecar files. Because what you want is for us to ignore notes is EAs when there is a .skim file. The .skim file is only supposed to be a backup, not a primary storage, so when there are notes in the EAs, we have no reason to look any further, and certainly not override them.

Christiaan

[Christiaan Hofman]

Post by Christiaan Hofman

Dropbox does not synchronize the extended attributes that Skim uses to store notes. I think that with a small modification to Skim, it would be easy to use .skim files to maintain synchronized notes across computers.
When I add a pdf to Computer A and then make some notes (and have "Automatically save Skim notes backups" checked), then the notes are saved to the extended attributes and a .skim file is created.
If I then open the pdf on Computer B, Skim notices that there is a .skim file (brought over by Dropbox) but no .skim notes (since the extended attribute was not synchronized), and helpfully asks me whether I want to read the notes from the .skim file. This behavior is exactly right in my opinion.
If I then change the the notes on computer B, the change is reflected in the .skim file on computer A, but not in the .pdf file, and I have to remember to read the notes on A in order to have them synchronized.
However, it should be easy to have Skim offer to read the notes, just as it does in the first case.
When I save the notes on computer B, the modify date of both the .pdf and the .skim files are updated. But when I go back to computer A, the modify date of the .pdf is older than the .skim file on that computer. (Dropbox brought the .skim file over, but since there was no change, for the attributes that Dropbox monitors, in the .pdf, the modify date of the .pdf was not changed).
If Skim noticed that the .skim file had a later modify date than the .pdf, and offered to read the notes from the .skim file, it would make keeping the notes in sync easy. Skim could put up the message like ("The notes associated with this file may have been modified, would you like to load the new notes?") I don't see any downside to this behavior, but perhaps I haven't thought enough about it.
I don't think that this would violate Christiaan's rule against sidecar files, which I can understand, even if I don't always agree with it.
Alan
--
Alan Harper

Yes, this goes strongly against my problems with sidecar files. Because what you want is for us to ignore notes is EAs when there is a .skim file. The .skim file is only supposed to be a backup, not a primary storage, so when there are notes in the EAs, we have no reason to look any further, and certainly not override them.
Christiaan

BTW, probably the best way to use Dropbox with skim notes is to covert to PDF bundles. The whole idea about a package is to really associate the different files, solving the problem of sidecar files.

Christiaan

[Alan Harper (lists)]

I can't use bundles because I associate my pdfs as attachments in my
bibliography management program (Sente) and it does not recognize .pdfd
files as a valid attachment kind. Also it appears that I cannot open pdfd
files with other pdf reader/editor programs, and sharing them with others
will be very difficult. (I didn't read up much on how pdfd files work,
other than bundling a bunch of files into a folder, so perhaps I am
mistaken here).

I don't want to try to maintain my own version of Skim, but perhaps Patrick
could send his code and I might try that for a while. I am not enough of a
programmer (or enough of a zealot) to try to maintain my own fork of Skim,
but it seems that many of us would prefer to use .skim files as sidecar
files, or even just to synchronize changes across Dropbox, rather than just
as backups as Christiaan prefers.

I understand Christiaan's preferences here, but I just need to get work
done, using multiple computers.

A

Post by Alan Harper (lists)
Dropbox does not synchronize the extended attributes that Skim uses to
store notes. I think that with a small modification to Skim, it would be
easy to use .skim files to maintain synchronized notes across computers.
When I add a pdf to Computer A and then make some notes (and have
"Automatically save Skim notes backups" checked), then the notes are saved
to the extended attributes and a .skim file is created.
If I then open the pdf on Computer B, Skim notices that there is a .skim
file (brought over by Dropbox) but no .skim notes (since the extended
attribute was not synchronized), and helpfully asks me whether I want to
read the notes from the .skim file. This behavior is exactly right in my
opinion.
If I then change the the notes on computer B, the change is reflected in
the .skim file on computer A, but not in the .pdf file, and I have to
remember to read the notes on A in order to have them synchronized.
However, it should be easy to have Skim offer to read the notes, just as
it does in the first case.
When I save the notes on computer B, the modify date of both the .pdf and
the .skim files are updated. But when I go back to computer A, the modify
date of the .pdf is older than the .skim file on that computer. (Dropbox
brought the .skim file over, but since there was no change, for the
attributes that Dropbox monitors, in the .pdf, the modify date of the .pdf
was not changed).
If Skim noticed that the .skim file had a later modify date than the .pdf,
and offered to read the notes from the .skim file, it would make keeping
the notes in sync easy. Skim could put up the message like ("The notes
associated with this file may have been modified, would you like to load
the new notes?") I don't see any downside to this behavior, but perhaps I
haven't thought enough about it.
I don't think that this would violate Christiaan's rule against sidecar
files, which I can understand, even if I don't always agree with it.
Alan
--
Alan Harper
Yes, this goes strongly against my problems with sidecar files. Because
what you want is for us to ignore notes is EAs when there is a .skim file.
The .skim file is only supposed to be a backup, not a primary storage, so
when there are notes in the EAs, we have no reason to look any further, and
certainly not override them.
Christiaan
BTW, probably the best way to use Dropbox with skim notes is to covert to
PDF bundles. The whole idea about a package is to really associate the
different files, solving the problem of sidecar files.
Christiaan
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tiers of
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reduces your MTTR. Get your free trial!
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